Quantity vs. Quality
In post secondary education, is it better to give a small number of students a higher quality of education or is it better to give a lesser quality to a larger number of students in order to gain recognition and accredidation for a school.
Why would it be an assumption that the larger classes will have a lesser quality of education? Can't a smaller class also get a lesser quality, depending on your instructor. Regardless of what accreditation agency you are working with, your quality of education should remain the consistent. We have found that having a larger class leads to students becoming mentors for other students that say they "just don't get it". Mentors working with instructors as well as other students together make for a more educational system. We have had more interaction and class discussions with the larger groups due to a variety of opinions.
Good points, Lisa. Quality isn't necessarily tied to class size. Certainly a class can be too small, where there isn't enough energy to effectively deliver content. Similarly, classes can be so large as to make interaction very difficult. The nature of the class – lecture or lab – also is an important variable. In the final analysis, quality is a reflection of the person delivering the content.
I feel that my question may have been misunderstood. Our Retention Basic is about school retention. What I meant to ask was more along the lines of, when a college is trying to establish themselves, which would be more beneficial in the long run of the institution. Is it better to try and keep a larger quantity of students enrolled in the school by giving them a lesser quality of work (which appeals to the slackers), or would it be more benificial in the long run by maybe estabalishing a more challenged program which appeals to the more committed student. I have observed in the past two years that you will lose the slacker if the structure contains a little higher quality of study, and you will also lose the more committed student when the program has little or no challanging structure.
It's not an “either … or†choice, Troy. Retention is the by-product of doing the right things the right way. Retention is about finding ways to raise the student to the standard, rather than lowering the standard. This is particularly important when a school is new in the market. Where you set your standards and how you treat your students determines how you are perceived for a long time. Most of the “slackers†that I have met really want to succeed. Many of them have never been successful and don't know how; they need to learn the tools. Is your institution ready to help?
I smypathize with the question Troy has raised. Our online programs are growing exponentially but we are challenged by attracting adult students who are not necessarily prepared for the level of work and rigor of study. I used to work in admissions and understand the importance of enrollment numbers. Now in student affairs, I am working with students who either did not listen to their admissions advisor about class expectations and time commitment or don't have the problem solving skills to stay the course when other things intefere in their life. We have recently added more resources to assist students with life issues, by referring them to a rescource and counseling service. We are working to expand our orientation and other communication tools to help students from admissions through graduation to be more successful. Our academic dean is working with faculty to keep standards high but make sure they are available to assist students who need extra help. When students call me about issues, I recommend they speak with their instructors as well as myself. We recognize we have a lot of work to do to increase retention. I really like your definition of retention as a by product of doing the right things the way. I am open to other suggestions you have on this topic.
Isolation is one of the major causes of attrition, Gail. Unfortunately, it is also very common in on-line programs. To counter-balance isolation, many schools require students to work in teams to try to build some connections with people and develop a support group. Instant messaging and voice over IP are tools that help these groups communicate.
Using temperament assessments also provides insight to help your advisors better understand the student and his/her preferred communication style. Making that information available to study group members can be very useful as well.
Anything you can do to give ‘personality' to an impersonal environment is going to help retention.
Thanks for your reply. Some of our online classes require group projects but not all. We are still working to develop chats and other tools for communication. We are also in the beginning stages of developing online student organizations. We are hopeful that some of these steps will develop a greater sense of community and break down the isolation you mentioned. Online education does present unique opportunities and challenges for developing community and meeting the needs of the type of student who selects online programs.
I feel that it is better to have quality than quantity. The better the student that we put out there the better it is for those involved all around. Putting a "lemon" out there is not going to help the school's reputation, nor will it help other students from that particular school, that's going out there with a purpose ( which is to succeed). It only helps the financial aspect. I can understand that, but we need not only to be concerned with money, but what are we giving our clients and customers?
It's hard to argue with your statement, Willinette. The challenge is finding an appropriate balance point. How do suggest avoiding ‘putting a lemon out there'?
Quality can be delivered to one or more students without the size. It is all in the presentation and perception.
I don't think the number of students should affect your quality of teaching a lesson. The lesson should be of the same quality every time you lecture.
In an impacted program, the quality may be affected if the instructor is also trying to provide hands on instruction as well as lecturing. In some cases this may lead to spreading oneself thin and thus not being as effective.
One of the things that distinguishes career schools from the traditional sector is the smaller size of classes. Furthermore, the lab portion of a course is usually taught by the same faculty member that delivered the lecture.
Is this really true, Windi? More students bring more questions and more disruptions. As an instructor, I find it more difficult to cover the normal syllabus when a class is much larger than normal. I find the converse it true too.
I do not find this to be true. It is my experience if an instructor manage his or her class, there is not any problems or the problems are minimun and a quality education can still take place. Instructors on my campus talk about this all the time, and we feel it is easilier to teach to a large class as opposed to a small class. With a large class, you can get the students involved more with group activities, students discussing and brainstorming off one another with different opinions filtering throughout the room. All of this can make the lecture very exciting if the teacher handle and manage the process correctly. The instructor has an opportunity to listen to the opinions of the students in each group and discuss those ideas in the lecture or closing remarks.
My definition of a quality lesson is when the instructor can teach a lesson, get feedback from his or her students, and both he and his students came away with something learned. So, as you can read, I enjoy large classes or mat least more than 5 students in a class. What's you opinion? LBrockett
I have tried, and struggled with this in lab. I use the lab to reinforce main points of my lecture. But with 30 students, I have to tailor my time, and lectures so I can spend less time answering remideal questions, or explain something I have repeatidly gone over before previously.
quality should be always be the same but for quantity the students may suffer due to the fact that the teacher may not have plentiful time for each student note: lab time is very much one on one teaching.
I guess if all you have to do is lecture, and you are in a lecture hall with 30 students, I agree the number of them won't matter, but what happens when you take them in a lab and there's only one of you to get around and tend to all 30 of them. Then what happens to their quality of learning? In our school the difference between 28 students in a class and 18 is huge! If a student can't get his/her hands on the equipment they lose interest and want to give up. So you stay late and tutor them, not because they have special needs, but because the institution has too many in one class.
Typically, lab size determines class size. What circumstance leads to too many students being assigned to a lab? How often does it happen? Are lab assistants used to provide support?
