Douglas, You make a good point. In every case, how the pre-test is presented is important. I tell my students "this is a non-graded assessment". Usually, when the students know they will not be penalized in any way, they will strive to try their best. Sometimes, at the end of a course, I will give the pretest again (as before, non-graded), to show how far they've come. In most cases the degree of improvement and mastery is high, and as a result, students will feel proud and motivated on their improvement, regardless how they perform. Barry Westling